AI makes you more creative, AI Roundtable with Steven Johnson and Grant Lee | E2231
Timestamps are as accurate as they can be but may be slightly off. We encourage you to listen to the full context.
Podcast Summary
This episode explores the profound impact of AI on productivity, creativity, and the future of work through conversations with two builders at the forefront of AI innovation. Host Jason Calacanis is joined by Grant Lee, CEO and co-founder of Gamma, and Steven Johnson, editorial director of NotebookLM at Google Labs. (03:00)
- Main theme: How AI tools are making knowledge workers more creative and productive rather than replacing human intelligence
The discussion reveals how these AI-first products are democratizing capabilities that previously required entire departments, while addressing concerns about AI making people less creative or capable of critical thinking. (34:10)
Speakers
Jason Calacanis
Host of This Week in Startups and angel investor with over 12 years of experience in venture capital. He's an investor in Athena and has backed numerous successful startups while creating the popular All In podcast format.
Grant Lee
Co-founder and CEO of Gamma, an AI-first visual storytelling platform that has reached over $100 million in revenue and raised a Series B at a $1.4 billion valuation led by Andreessen Horowitz. Previously worked in consulting and investment banking before founding Gamma to solve his own presentation challenges.
Steven Johnson
Editorial director of NotebookLM at Google Labs and accomplished author of multiple books including "Farsighted" and "How We Got to Now." Co-created the influential 1990s zine Feed and has been exploring the intersection of technology and human creativity for decades.
Key Takeaways
AI Amplifies Rather Than Replaces Human Creativity
Steven Johnson argues that AI tools make him "a more original writer and thinker" by handling the tedious research and organizational work, freeing him to focus on creative insights and compelling narratives. (34:29) He explains that roughly 50% of his book-writing time was previously spent on "chores" like organizing chronologies and managing sources. AI now handles these tasks, allowing him to concentrate on what he does best: creating interesting content and compelling prose.
Context Engineering Is the Key to Powerful AI Applications
Both speakers emphasize that AI's real power comes from loading it with specific, relevant sources rather than using generic chatbots. (08:52) Grant describes how Gamma uses customer feedback by dumping entire Slack conversations into NotebookLM to build user personas and understand pain points. This allows teams to have "high-level conversations with their whole user base" about features and products, creating insights that weren't previously possible.
Organizations Can Eliminate Traditional Support Roles
Jason shares the example of a startup that reached $1 million in revenue without hiring a lawyer, accountant, or HR person, instead using AI tools to handle legal document analysis and contract negotiations. (22:32) This represents a fundamental shift in how startups can be structured, with AI potentially replacing entire departments that were previously considered essential.
AI Creates Jevons Paradox Effects in Knowledge Work
Grant explains how AI efficiency leads to increased usage rather than decreased demand, similar to how more efficient steam engines led to higher coal consumption in the 1800s. (56:40) In coding, they're seeing "much more internal software being developed" and "personal apps being developed" because the barriers have been lowered. This suggests AI will create entirely new categories of work rather than simply eliminating existing jobs.
Early Adopters Become Exponentially More Valuable
Jason observes that employees who master AI tools become "50 times, 20 times more valuable" than those who don't, with the collective value of AI-skilled workers often exceeding entire teams of traditional workers. (62:59) He emphasizes that learning these tools is recursive - you can literally ask the AI how to use the AI, making the learning curve more accessible than traditional programming.
Statistics & Facts
- Gamma reached over $100 million in revenue in approximately 2+ years and raised a Series B at a $1.4 billion valuation. (07:07)
- According to Pew Research from June 2025, 53% of U.S. adults believe increased AI use will make people's creativity worse, while only 16% think it will make creativity better. (40:05)
- Steven Johnson estimates that roughly 50% of his book-writing time was previously spent on "chores" like organizing information, managing sources, and creating bibliographies rather than actual creative writing. (49:29)
