Stop Coding Emails: Loops Co-founder and CEO Chris Frantz
Timestamps are as accurate as they can be but may be slightly off. We encourage you to listen to the full context.
Podcast Summary
In this episode, Turner Novak interviews Chris Frantz, cofounder and CEO of Loops, the email sending platform for software companies. Chris shares why email remains critical for software businesses, despite the proliferation of communication channels. (02:28) He explains that pre-series D companies typically use 2-5 different tools to email their users, creating fragmentation and complexity. The conversation explores Chris's unconventional approach to building a bootstrapped, product-led company that skipped Series A funding and operates with zero marketing or sales teams. (16:58) Chris discusses his framework for sustainable growth, the importance of talking directly to customers, and why he believes the best way to improve customer acquisition cost is to build a better product, not better ads.
- Main themes include the critical importance of email infrastructure for software companies, product-led growth strategies, and building sustainable businesses without traditional marketing approaches
Speakers
Chris Frantz
Chris Frantz is the cofounder and CEO of Loops, an email sending platform designed specifically for software companies. He previously spent years in marketing and growth roles, including being the fifth hire at Curiosity Stream (founded by Discovery Channel's John Hendricks), where he managed millions in monthly ad spending. Chris also founded and sold Snazzy AI, one of the first GPT wrapper companies, to Unbounce for a seven-figure sum. He's known for his unconventional approach to building businesses, having skipped traditional Series A fundraising and operating Loops with an entirely technical team of nine remote employees.
Turner Novak
Turner Novak is the host of The Peel podcast and founder of Banana Capital, a venture capital fund. He focuses on investing in and interviewing founders of high-growth startups, exploring the stories behind successful companies and the lessons learned along the way.
Key Takeaways
Build a Better Product, Not Better Ads
Chris emphasizes that the most effective way to reduce customer acquisition costs isn't through improved advertising, but through product excellence. (18:57) Drawing from his experience spending millions on ads at Curiosity Stream, he learned that sustainable growth comes from product-market fit, not marketing optimization. This insight led him to focus entirely on product development at Loops, resulting in near-zero churn rates above certain revenue thresholds and organic word-of-mouth growth without any traditional marketing efforts.
Engineers Should Handle Customer Support
Loops operates with an all-engineer team where technical staff handle customer support directly. (59:57) Chris explains this creates a powerful feedback loop: engineers hate being told repeatedly that something doesn't work, so they're highly motivated to fix issues immediately. This approach results in fewer bugs, better product development, and 24/7 global technical coverage. While unconventional, it ensures that the people building the product directly understand customer pain points and can resolve issues quickly.
Personal Onboarding Builds Product Understanding
Chris personally onboarded every customer for the first year and a half of Loops, conducting hundreds of conversations with users. (1:02:12) This direct customer engagement taught him exactly what the market needed and informed product decisions that the company still operates on today. He emphasizes that founders should genuinely enjoy talking to their target audience - if you don't like lawyers, don't build legal software. This deep customer understanding has allowed Loops to compete successfully against larger engineering teams.
Simplify Your Business Framework
Chris operates on an elegantly simple business philosophy: talk to users, build the product, share updates, and repeat forever. (1:00:19) This straightforward approach eliminates complexity and keeps the team focused on what matters most. Combined with their remote-first, all-technical team structure, this framework has enabled Loops to achieve profitability and consistent growth without traditional sales or marketing efforts. The simplicity allows for rapid iteration and clear decision-making.
Revenue Timing Determines Growth Strategy
Chris chose to skip Series A fundraising despite hitting the traditional $1M ARR benchmark because he didn't believe they had achieved true product-market fit. (47:07) He argues that raising money before reaching genuine product-market fit can lead to premature scaling and unsustainable growth. Instead, Loops remained bootstrapped and cash flow positive, allowing them to build at their own pace and maintain control over their direction. This patience-first approach has resulted in a more sustainable business model.
Statistics & Facts
- There are 7-8 publicly traded companies that are primarily email sending businesses, including Mailchimp which sold to Intuit for $12 billion. (05:44) This demonstrates the massive scale and value of the email infrastructure market.
- Pre-Series D software companies typically use between 2-5 different tools to email their users, creating fragmentation across marketing, engineering, and communication functions. (08:46) This statistic highlights the market opportunity that Loops is addressing.
- Loops has achieved practically zero churn above a certain price point (around 5,000-10,000 users) after being in business for four years. (13:32) This indicates strong product-market fit and customer satisfaction in their target market.
