#1033- Judd Apatow - Why Comedies Suck Now
Timestamps are as accurate as they can be but may be slightly off. We encourage you to listen to the full context.
Podcast Summary
In this episode, filmmaker and comedian Judd Apatow explores how personal pain and uncertainty can become the catalyst for creative brilliance. (00:00) Apatow shares candid insights about his parents' tumultuous double divorce and how childhood trauma shaped his comedic voice, explaining how discomfort makes you "more sensitive" and transforms you into an observer of the world. (02:55) The conversation delves into the unique challenges of comedy as an art form where you can only learn by practicing in public, the evolving landscape of comedy films, and the delicate balance between artistic integrity and commercial collaboration. (21:30) Apatow also discusses the importance of mentorship, the psychology of bombing on stage, and how to harness hypervigilance as a creative superpower while learning to manage the emotional intensity that comes with it. • Main themes: The relationship between trauma and creativity, the challenges of practicing comedy in public, navigating Hollywood collaborations, and transforming uncertainty into artistic fuel.
Speakers
Judd Apatow
Judd Apatow is a filmmaker, producer, comedian, and writer known for directing and producing some of the most influential comedy films of the past two decades. His work includes "The 40-Year-Old Virgin," "Knocked Up," "This is 40," and "Trainwreck," along with producing hit comedies like "Anchorman," "Talladega Nights," and "Bridesmaids." Apatow also created and executive produced critically acclaimed TV series including "Freaks and Geeks" and "Girls," and has worked as a writer and producer on "The Larry Sanders Show."
Chris Williamson
Chris Williamson is the host of Modern Wisdom, one of the world's most popular podcasts focused on psychology, philosophy, and self-improvement. With over 1,000 episodes and millions of downloads, Williamson has interviewed leading experts across various fields including psychology, business, comedy, and performance optimization.
Key Takeaways
Turn Pain Into Creative Fuel Through Hypervigilance
Apatow explains how his parents' traumatic double divorce created a hypervigilant state that became essential to his creative process. (02:55) When you experience significant pain or instability, it makes you "more sensitive" and forces you to become an observer of the world because "you feel like, wait, this isn't working out the way I wanted it to. Why?" This hypervigilance, while often uncomfortable, becomes a superpower for noticing details others miss - like seeing comedy gold in mundane interactions between an air hostess and passenger. The key is learning to harness this obsessive observation without letting it consume your personal life.
Embrace "Bombing as R&D" Mentality
Comedy is unique because you can only learn by practicing in public, making every bomb a valuable research opportunity. (21:30) Apatow describes how each new joke is an experiment - if it works, it goes on the "it works pile," and if it bombs, you learn what doesn't work. The courage comes from understanding that "every night, you're doing things that work, and then you're trying to figure out if you have the courage to do the experimental part because it kills your set sometimes." This mindset transforms failure from devastating rejection into valuable data collection.
Separate Creative Flow from Judgment
Effective creativity requires separating the creation phase from the evaluation phase. (48:05) Apatow's approach is to "spew and write and free write and not judge it. And then the next day, I go into judgment mode and read it and decide if there's anything of value." This prevents the inner critic from blocking creative flow during the generative process. When you try to create and judge simultaneously, "you slow down because you're trying to do it at the same time," which kills the spontaneous magic that makes comedy work.
Build Trust-Based Collaborative Relationships
The most successful creative partnerships are built on trust and honest feedback, even when it's uncomfortable. (70:00) Apatow values collaborators who will tell him "hey, I don't think the third act is working so well" because they know they can challenge him without hesitation. The nightmare scenario is working with someone who "doesn't get it" where you're having creative debates with people on completely different wavelengths. True collaborators care more about the quality of the work than preserving egos or maintaining politeness.
Develop "Good Heart" Authenticity for Edgy Content
You can say almost anything on stage if people sense your genuine goodness underneath. (50:53) Apatow explains that audiences make "very subtle human observations" about whether you're coming from a place of genuine exploration or mean-spirited cruelty. Comedians like Jimmy Carr and Shane Gillis "get away with saying some wild stuff, but there's something in their spirit that makes it okay" because audiences know "where their heart is" even in the most controversial material. The audience can sense the difference between someone working through difficult topics with genuine curiosity versus someone being cruel for its own sake.
Statistics & Facts
- Roger Federer won nearly 80% of his 1,526 singles matches but only won 54% of all points played, demonstrating that even the greatest performers lose nearly every other attempt. (49:04)
- In the old days, comedy movies would make significant revenue from DVD sales that often matched box office earnings, but streaming eliminated this revenue stream without replacing it, fundamentally changing the economics of comedy filmmaking. (63:45)
- No specific industry statistics about comedy or filmmaking were provided beyond the Federer comparison and DVD revenue context.
